Here is the very ending of the movie. Go ahead and watch it all. And here is the trailer for the companion movie to what we watched today, "Letters From Iwo Jima." Watch it too.
Clint Eastwood made one other war movie, starring himself, 1986's "Heartbreak Ridge," which is not bad—it's on cable TV quite a bit so maybe you can catch it then (check out the trailer here). But it is nowhere in the same league as the films we just watched. "American Sniper" and "Flags of Our Fathers" are, to us, the works of a fully formed artist: complicated, complex, messy, calling out for close inspection—which is what we will do with them tomorrow in class. As someone noticed in class, "FofOF" lost money: it was a commercial disappointment, while "AS," as we've said several times, was a gigantic hit. Two war movies, one about the Greatest Generation and one about a war that no one wanted to pay attention, yet the one about the unpopular war was the success. What's up with that?
1. Hazard a guess: why was "American Sniper" be so popular while "Flags of Our Fathers" was a money loser? Two very graphic, very complex, very sad (if not depressing) war movies: was it simply Bradley Cooper's star power or the fact that the first one came out in the middle of Operation Iraqi Freedom, i.e. The Iraq War? Think about this for a minute—and discard Bradley Cooper (two of his latest films, "Serena" and "Aloha," were disasters financially): what might have made the one more popular than the other?
2. Your reaction to "Flags of Our Fathers"? In answering this, say what you think the film is about—a war story yes, but much of it does not take place on the battlefield. So how would you describe this movie to a friend? And in answering this, tell what scene or moment stuck with you—and why?
3. Clark and I were talking after the movie and listing all the themes the movie addressed: war (of course), American history, American mythology, masculinity...but above all, heroism. What do you see the movie saying about heroism? What moment or moment(s) make clear what it is saying about heroism? AND is it and "American Sniper" saying similar things? If so, how? If not, what is different?
4. Finally: what do you make of the ending—the clip at the start of this page? Why end the film on this note?
Some of you on the last blogs skimped significantly on your answers. One sentence responses are not enough. That gets you a 50 rather than a 100. Really answer these questions. We'll discuss tomorrow. We expect everyone to contribute. Have a good night.
1. In my unprofessional opinion I would surmise that there are two main reasons why American Sniper was so much more popular than Flag of Our Fathers. Firstly, like you mentioned, I think that the timing of the release of American Sniper was almost impeccable. When American Sniper came out there were two very polarized opinions in the US, either for the Iraqi War or against it. Though Clint Eastwood has said that he is completely for the Iraqi War, American Sniper Makes a compelling case both for and against the war. Many people saw it to “further their knowledge” but came out with the same opinion they had going in. Secondly, in my opinion, the story of American Sniper is simply more interesting. Though it was graphic the movie did not show me anything I had not already seen. Kyle’s decision about whether or not to shoot a kid had me on the edge of my seat, while Flag of Our Fathers lacked any true ethical conflict that the American people could relate to.
ReplyDelete2. This movie, to me, is about a son’s journey to understand the life his father never spoke of. His father was one of the men lifting the flag in the famous photo on top of Iwo Jima. The movie shows what the men went through when the fought in Iwo Jima and what their lives were like once they returned home and were labeled heroes. The scene that stuck with me the most was when Doc was forced to lie to Hank’s mother, telling her that that was her son in the photo. In my opinion this scene was the height of the ethical drama in this movie. Though I believe Doc made the right choice by lying to her, I easily see the case for the other side.
3. I think the movie says that heroes are only in comic books and movie. Labeling men heroes, especially war heroes, is something people do to make themselves feel better. The men in the movie were not labeled heroes because of an incredibly brave act, but rather because the American government believed the American people needed heroes to buy war bonds. This movie says to me that the creation of heroes if for the creator more than for the hero. I think American Sniper sends a different message. At first Kyle rejects his nickname, “The Legend” but I believe at the end it is what incentivizes to help the other veterans. American Sniper portrays the creation of a hero in a much more positive light.
4. I think the end of the movie was created to portray just how young these men were. I highly doubt that the men in American Sniper would have run into the water laughing while they got on each other shoulders and played juvenile games. I believe that Eastwood is trying to show the tragedy of the young lives lost on that mountain.
I honestly think that the story of American Sniper was far more interesting and current to the general populace than that of Flags of our Fathers. The former was focused on a concentrated story of one man’s journey through war, PTSD, and struggles with his family, while the latter was more of a film about heroism and the way America conned people in a way with the use of the flag photograph. American Sniper is simply a more exciting, fast-paced, and streamlined movie, and one that addresses very modern and concrete issues. It also came out shortly after the death of Chris Kyle, which left his story fresh on people’s minds.
ReplyDeleteI would say that the film is mostly about the concept of heroism and, more specifically, so-called war heroes. It also focuses on the way this status affects the fresh veterans. I’d describe Flags of our Fathers as more of a philosophical and conflicted war film, as opposed to a fairly straightforward movie like American Sniper. There were a few scenes that really stuck with me while viewing this— First of all, on the actual battlefield, all the scenes where American soldiers actually killed Japanese men up-close were extremely horrific, as you could see even in the faces of the men doing the killing that they were realizing these enemies were actually young men just like themselves. It was pretty awful watching the Japanese soldiers die in pain, like the one that Doc (I believe) stabs with his bayonet shortly before Iggy disappears. I also was quite affected by the scene where Doc finds Ira outside the bar, where they won’t serve him, a war hero, just because of his race.
The ‘heroism’ in this film was quite different from the sort portrayed in American Sniper. While the three central flag-raisers of Flags of our Fathers certainly went through hell and deserved recognition, they didn’t actually do what most of the people seemed to believe— The raising of the flag didn’t somehow win the battle. The heroes themselves clearly realize this, and it seems as though the American government and bond companies are actually monetizing the heroism (though admittedly for a reasonable cause). Chris Kyle, meanwhile, actually did kill all the people he was credited with. The two films do share a similar idea, however— The soldiers that others call heroes are clearly, at the very least, uncomfortable with the idea of being called thus, and seem to not consider themselves heroes, just men doing their jobs.
To me, the ending showed that the soldiers were really just boys. Even though they were trained fighters sent off to kill other men, a lot of them looked like they were barely eighteen. It was easy to forget that throughout the film, as most of it focuses on the soldiers’ lives in the war and after it. Seeing the barely adult soldiers splashing around in the water drove home that they were just kids who were in a situation far beyond their- or our- understanding.
There was a lot of hype surrounding American Sniper. When the movie was released, last January, Chris Kyle was in the news. He had a bestselling book out, a man, who was featured in Kyle’s book, was suing Kyle’s wife, and his killer was standing trial. Also, there haven’t been that many movies about the war in Iraq. Despite the large opposition to the war, most of the movies about the Iraqi war are popular. For example The Hurt Locker or Jarhead. In contrast, there are a host of movies about World War II. Maybe, in 2006, there wasn’t a ton of demand for another World War II movie.
ReplyDeleteI loved the movie. I saw the movie when it first came out, and I was a too young to understand what the movie was really about. Furthermore, I probably shouldn’t have been watching this movie when I was 9. This movie is more about the home front than the actual war. The struggle to generate money to support the war was a big theme throughout. Also, the movie displays the severity of PTSD. The main character, Doc, still has night terrors about his experience toward the end of his life. In American Sniper, Kyle sheds his PTSD symptoms, but Flags of Our Fathers suggests that PTSD is not so easy to cure.
Real heros never admit to being heros. They stay humble, and they attribute their success to other men. We see this in both American Sniper and Flags of Our Fathers. Ira and Doc are both reluctant to go on tour, unlike Rene. Ira and Doc were both courageous men and both denied being heroes. In contrast, Rene basked in his fifteen minutes of fame, and Ira reveals that he didn’t even fire his weapon on Iwo Jima. Chris Kyle disliked his nickname “the legend.” He was a legend to many soldiers and civilians, but he didn’t feel like he deserved that label.
War is a very mature matter, yet, especially in World War II, innocent boys did the fighting. The last scene was meant to show how young these boys were. In the midst of all this chaos, they found time to be boys.
Sam Brasher
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ReplyDeleteFrankly, I think that American Sniper was a better movie by a wide margin, and there are a couple reasons why I have come to that conclusion. First, the storyline is more narrowed: it’s easy to focus on one (potential) hero and his mission that the scope of an entire war. Viewers like characters, and learning all about them. Flags of our Fathers lacked the in-depth character development that American Sniper perfected. Whether we liked Chris Kyle, hated Chris Kyle, thought he was a hero, or thought he was morally abhorrent, we at least got to put ourselves in his shoes and try to feel what he felt. In my opinion, that is where Flags of Out Fathers fell flat.
ReplyDeleteAs I mentioned in the above answer, I didn’t really like Flags of Our Fathers, especially considering I came in with high expectations. Above all, I came away from this movie thinking it’s overarching theme was about how misconstrued that one photo truly is. The one scene that continues to play in my mind is the one in which they’re climbing the “rock” at Soldier Field. The crowd is cheering, the lights are flashing, but all they can envision is their friends who are fighting a gruesome war over seas. It highlighted the fraudulent bond tour they were on, and how little the public actually knows about War.
When I think about this movie and heroism I immediately picture Ira crying at the end. Ira is a hero, but he doesn’t know it. Those who died are heroes and didn’t live to know it. But I also think it’s important to note one someone (I forget who) says. He says that heroes are simply created by us – those unfamiliar with the situation – in order to try to understand what’s going on. That’s why they’re trotted around trying to get people to buy bonds. I actually think this movie is trying to tell us that heroes really don’t exist in the way we think they do. American Sniper isn’t saying that traditional heroes don’t exist, but rather that people have different ideas about who a hero is.
I think that closing statement about heroes being contrived from our own imagination for a better understanding (as I referenced earlier) is important in understanding the bigger message of the film. I also think it was vital – in such a dark film – to end on a bit of a bright note. First with the uplifting way in which he died (if that’s possible), and then with the shot of the soldiers swimming. Even though it is an overall sad scene, it leaves the viewer on at least a bit of a positive note.
Max Marcovitch
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ReplyDeleteI can come up with a number of potential factors as to why “American Sniper” was significantly more popular than “Flags of our Fathers.” The first being that the war scenes in “American Sniper” are much easier to watch. Viewers want to see the heroes kill the bad guys. However “Flags of our Fathers” shows young American boys being obliterated by Japanese troops. On the other hand, the majority of the action scenes in “American Sniper” show Kyle killing the enemy. Another reason could be the fact that the storyline of “Flags of our Fathers” is far less interesting and at times difficult to follow.
ReplyDeleteAfter seeing how much money the film lost, I did not anticipate enjoying it and to my expectations, I was not a fan of “Flags of our Fathers.” I would describe the movie as a war story focused on what soldiers and their families experience back home. The scene that stuck with me most was when Ira was refused service by the bartender. Despite being a famous “war hero” he is not served a drink.
I think the film shows just how unclear the label of “hero” really is. Though the American population considers the men to be heroes, the men themselves certainly do not see themselves in that light, especially Ira. The heroism in "Flags of Our Fathers” and “American Sniper” is similar because in both movies, the heroes, do not embrace the title at all.
The ending was probably my favorite part of the entire film. I think it was meant to do two things. The first being to have one lighthearted scene in an incredibly dark and depressing film. And the second being to show just how young the boys fighting in the war really were.
1. Bradley cooper being in "American Sniper" movie did have a significant part in making the movie a success, I think. It drew people into watching this movie and once people did watch it, and enjoyed it, they spread the word about how good this movie was, I assume. I personally don't know why this one was a success while "Flags of Our Fathers" wasn't. Possibly due to the Iraq war is happening right now while "FofOF" was later after the war.
ReplyDelete2. I believe that Flags was about the real story behind that picture. Yes, it pertained to war, but it had a side of it that the public was foggy about. It also showed how much money the US didn't have. The "heroes" having to go on tour asking for people to by bonds depicts it quite well. A scene that really stuck with me was when Doc was walking up that fake mountain at the baseball game and kept having flashbacks. It stuck with me because it shows that the putting up of the flag is more than just putting puma flag to them. There's meaning behind it.
3. The movie says that heroes aren't real. We, as average civilians, need someone we can look to for hope. The picture of the flag gave hope for victory. The scene with Ira talking to the general in the hotel room saying he wasn't a hero, that mike was a real hero was a real indication that heroes are just made up. Then the general said that if mike was in Ira's spot that he would probably be denying his heroism. It does have its similarities the way Chris Kyle takes his "heroism." Chris doesn't directly state his heroism but he does try to avoid being "The Myth" or "The Legend." He simply says he was doing what he had to do.
4. I personally found that ending really sweet. Though this terrible war was waging around them, they were able to find joy, as a unit, together. Even something as simple as swimming in the pacific brought so much happiness to those men. Swimming, even for a short period of time, distracts them from the horrors of war which is happening not even 100 feet from them. They don't know if they will be together tomorrow but at that time they are together and are happy. It made me smile.
1. In my opinion I think that American Sniper was a much bigger hit than Flags of Our Fathers in the box office because of the timing of its release. American Sniper was released pretty soon after the Iraq War and only a year after Chris Kyle died. Flags of Our Fathers was released about 60 years after the events actually took place in WWII. It is much harder to relate to a movie that is set that long ago. Also, Flags of Our Fathers was a very heavy and graphic war movie. Most of the really intense scenes were scenes that involved a lot of disgusting violence and disturbing images. Even though American Sniper is also a very graphic war movie, it wasn't quite as disturbing. It had a lot of very intense emotional scenes where you didn't really know what was going to happen next, while Flags of Our Fathers was just a lot of predictable death and carnage being thrown in your face.
ReplyDelete2. I liked Flags of Our Fathers, but not as much as American Sniper because it was kind of confusing and a little too depressing and graphic for my taste. All of the flashbacks and changes in setting and time had me very confused and disoriented, especially towards the beginning of the movie. Also, the very first battle scene at Iwo Jima was very gory and violent. All of the bodies and destruction was too much for me. I understand that those things probably happened, but I don't really like seeing it. If I was describing this movie to a friend, I would say that it is a story based off of the soldiers, both who died and survived, that raised the flags on Iwo Jima during WWII. It goes through the actual events on the island leading up to and during the raising of the flags and the famous photograph taken, but it also shows what happened to the members of the photo who survived and were able to go back State Side and use the photo to gain publicity for people to buy war bonds. The moment that stuck with me the most was how the Japanese soldiers blew themselves up using grenades. It stuck with me because of how dedicated they were to their cause that they would rather kill themselves than surrender and also because of the bloody and grisly images of their bodies.
(It wouldn't let me post mine all together, so the rest is below)
3. I think that Flags of Our Fathers tried to show heroism as more than simply raising a flag. As much as it could, I think it also wanted to avoid showing calling the men heroes as a good thing. I think it's commentary in heroism has more to do with the men who died and fought Bradley for their country instead of a few people who were photographed putting up a replacement flag. I also think the movie recognizes that the survivors in the photo did need to happen to win the war, but the real heroes were the ones who died on the beach. When they would show all of the times that the survivors would speak, they always said the casualties were the real heroes. Also, when they showed all of the people involved in the flag raising dying, they showed each one in a very sad and somber tone. It seemed to me that Clint Eastwood was honoring their memories and showing how brave they were, even to the very end. In American Sniper, I think that it shows heroism in a very different way. Flags of Our Fathers showed heroism as doing everything you could to keep your friends and fellow comrades alive by being completely selfless. In American Sniper it showed heroism as taking out a lot of bad guys, and in doing so, saving a lot of lives. In my opinion, it seemed like American Sniper embraced the term "war hero" much more than Flags of Our Fathers.
ReplyDelete4. I think that Clint Eastwood wanted to end the movie by showing all of the men that participated in the raising of the flags together and happy as a kind of tribute to the people in the photograph who died. In all of the scenes in the U.S., the people who died were never treated with any respect except by the "Iwo Jima Heros." I think Clint Eastwood wanted to make sure that they'd got the respect they actually deserved like the other three survivors. Additionally, I think that he wanted to show the men actually were in the eyes of Corpsman John Bradley, who was actually there, like they said in the movie.
I believe that American Sniper was more popular because it was about a war that was happening, also the tragedy of Chris Kyle's murder had just occurred. The news of this murder was everywhere. I believe this made people feel compelled to go see American Sniper to honor the man, or just out of pure interest. I definitely think Bradley Cooper's star power boosted the popularity of the film. Also, American Sniper was a lot less disturbing than Flags of our Fathers. In Flags of our Fathers there were so many dead bodies on both sides, and it is extremely disturbing that the "heroes" (the three main characters) had no life after their fame, no one to even help them get a good job. But, mostly, I believe it was because the Iraqi war was so current that boosted the popularity of the movie. Another disturbing scene was when the bar waiter wouldn't serve Doc.
ReplyDeleteFlags of our Fathers was very gruesome there were tons on scenes with dead bodies, and I didn't like it. The worst scene was definitely when it shows the Japanese who blew themselves up with grenades. That being said, if you were a war movie fan I think you would like this movie. It was directed well, had good acting, (decent props), and it showed the many horrors of war. This movie wasn't only a war movie, it was a movie meant to show everything that soldiers went through in the Japanese war. I also found it really interesting how the soldiers who came back weren't the heroes yet they took credit for being heroes. It was sad how one of the soldiers had to drink so much to live with himself. This movie took something that seemed good and turned it into something very hard to live with. (Being labeled a hero but not being one.)
The movie says heroes don't really exist. People label others as heroes to make themselves feel better. The heroes in this movie are hardly heroes, they are just there to help to get people to donate money. But, they acknowledge that they aren't the real heroes, the people lying dead in Iwo Jima are the real heroes. The most clear moment where the movie is trying to show heroism is when the Marine and Doc are forced to lie to their friend's mothers that the people who set up the flag in the picture were their sons. American Sniper and Sons of our Fathers both show the same thing about being a hero. War heroes don't really want to be heroes, but they will accept it.
I think it was good to end the movie on a happy note because otherwise I would have been sad all day. At the same time, I found the ending sentimental with all the guys running into the water and going swimming. I found it very interesting what he said about the "heroes," "We should remember them for who they were, the way my dad remembered them." Clint Eastwood ended the movie showing all the soldiers playing with each other in the water to show the war was over. He also did it to show they had made friendships and trusted each other because they fought for one another.
1. I think that the timing of the releases is incredibly important. American Sniper was released during the war in Iraq, and although certainly no one has forgotten about it, WWII was long ago, and doesn't have the same pull that an issue more relevant to people today might have. Even discounting the star power of Bradley Cooper, American Sniper is a story that takes place during the a period where moviegoers can relate to the characters and the scenarios that they're placed in.
ReplyDelete2. Flags of our Fathers is certainly a war movie, but it's more than that. Personally, I didn't care for it as much as I did American Sniper, but I still enjoyed the film. I would describe it as a war movie, but with much more deeper meaning and symbolism than most. The movie also didn't hold back with some of the most traumatic parts of war. The things that stuck out to me were the brutal tortures that are referenced, both in the pictures, and the story of Iggy.
3. Flags of our Fathers makes a point about heroism that I believe to be widely accepted by those who are informed to at least a small extent about war. They make the point that heroes aren't always those who we see or hear about, but they are rather the people who don't come back, who game their lives for their country. The heroes aren't just the men on display, like in a famous picture, but the heroes are the men behind the scenes, who don't get the recognition that they deserve. It also makes the point that not everyone in war is a hero. American Sniper attempts to make a similar point, but many people view Chris Kyle as a hero nonetheless. American Sniper fails at delivering that point well, and doesn't quite hammer it home like Flags of our Fathers does.
4. I actually really enjoyed the ending. There's something really heartwarming about it. There's a final connection between father and son prior to the father's death, and the unit, as a group, let loose and go swimming together. All throughout their swim, the narrator speaks of how the men might've fought for their country, they died for their friends, beside them or in front of them. I find that to be an incredibly bittersweet thought, but a meaningful one. Ending the film like that leaves the viewer with a positive note, and an uplifting ending.
1. It makes sense that American Sniper made more money and was more popular than Flags of our Fathers for one reason: star power. Bradley Cooper is such a huge name that almost any movie made with him will make money. This coupled with the fact that Chris Kyle's book had already garnered popularity for his story is an explanation for the money difference between the two movies.
ReplyDelete2. I think that Flags of our Fathers was deeper than American Sniper in a couple of levels. It went deeper than American Sniper in the physchological aspect of coming home from war and war veterans. I was not sure what I expected from this film, but I expected a lot more from American Sniper because of all the media hype and attention it got. These feelings I had towards both movies before watching is also an explanation as to why American Sniper made more money.
3. The idea of heroism is brought about in a different way in Flags of our Fathers. It is trying to express heroism as something that one single person can achieve, like a superhero. This movie is showing us that a group of people working together are all heroes, and multiple men can achieve the title through hardwork without necessarily wanting to be called heroes.
4. I thought the ending was perfect because it wrapped up the hard-fought movie with a less tough note. One of the youtube comments on the video mentioned that swimming makes the men appear less masculine and more childlike in nature, which is nice because it shows how innocent and youthful all these men are together.
1. American Sniper's popularity for me had to do with the fact it was released during the war it was about and this war is still a huge issue within our country. Other than that it is kind of odd to me how Flags of our Fathers lost money. I enjoyed the movie in most parts but I didn't enjoy the flashing back and forth between historical events and the present. The chronological order that American Sniper followed was easier to follow and really helped you connect with the story. the movies were about to very separate things too. American Sniper was a about a man who had killed so many people and was a war hero and how he coped. Flags of our Fathers was about what really happened on Iwo Jima. The plot for American Sniper was definitely more entertaining.
ReplyDelete2. The movie was very educational to me. I had never know where that famous image was from and the backstory behind it. The movie was about the men in the picture's experience in the war and what the picture really was. It was definitely interesting how the government was so broke and they needed to use this picture to make money. These men realized people back home had no idea what was happening. The part where the Japanese were blowing themselves up stuck with me. It was very hard to watch at that point.
3. It is really about how these men, who I think we're heroic for just being in the war, didn't see themselves as heroes. The picture was of the second raising of the flag whereas in the first raising the 3rd platoon had risked their lives to go up the mountain. The American people all see these men as heroes. As I said before I believe they were heroes because of their experiences and bravery in the war.
4. I like the part of the ending when all the guys are going swimming, it really shows them as humans and frankly they were just kids. It's kind of a relief from all of the sadness during the movie. I don't know if I agree with the quote saying there are no heroes. Heroes are something we create in our mind. This can be true because you don't ever really know the whole story or every side of the person.
ReplyDelete1. I do think that part of American Sniper's popularity is due to the timing of its release. The Iraq war is still a fresh issue in our country while World War II has been over for quite some time. Because the Iraq War is still a fresh issue it made the movie even more controversial, which caused more people to talk and see the movie. I also think that American Sniper is a bit easier to follow than Flags of Our Fathers. In the Flags of Our Fathers, a lot of the movie is skipping around on a timeline. Finally, someone who is squeamish would be able to watch American Sniper but probably wouldn't be able to watch the Flags of Our Fathers. The Flags of Our Fathers is harder to watch.
2. The film centers around three men that become famous for having their pictures taken as they were raising the flag on Iwo Jima. I think that this film is a story about war and fame and the type of impact these experiences can have on a person. It exemplifies these ideas through their PTSD and what happens to them on their propaganda tour. One of the moments that stuck with me the most was when Doc, Ira, and Keyes were climbing up the plaster mountain on the field to recreate the moment when they put up the flag. While they are climbing up the side they have flashbacks to the deaths of the other 3 men that put up the flag with them. These men that lived didn't believe that they were the heroes of the battle, that the true heroes died back on Iwo Jima. It was very intense to see them remembering their comrades that died.
3. When the Rene, Ira, and Doc return to the United States they do not believe that they are heroes. They say multiple times that the real heroes of Iwo Jima are all the men that didn't make it home. Ira says that he isn't a real hero, instead that Mike, a man that died on the island was a hero. These three men are hailed as heroes wherever they go, but they are in denial about their heroism. I think that the movie is saying that heroes are also humble about their heroism, they do not brag. It also points out that all heroes are not perfect, as we see Ira drunk and Rene saying some rude things. I think is also says that heroism is very subjective. American Sniper does say some similar things. Chris, like Ira, Rene, and Doc, also believes that he is not a hero, and that those that the real heroes of a war are the men that die. Chris wouldn't brag about how accurate his shots are, he remained humble.
4. The Flags of Our Fathers ends with the group that raised that flag swimming. They are like children in the water, reminding the audience of how young these men are. There is an erie happiness to this scene as the audience knows that some of these men will die in the next couple of days. There is a feeling of artificial happiness to it. At the end it also pulls back and has the American Flag flying on top of the island and the soldiers swimming in the background. This shot is to remind the audience of how putting up the flag didn't seem like a big event to anyone there, it was just an ordinary day for all of the soldiers. But this small simple act became so much more because of just one photograph.
"American Sniper" was so popular because of Bradley Cooper and because the Chris Kyle story is a very interesting. Bradley Cooper is a great actor and he portrays Chris Kyle very well, he acts like, looks like and sounds like him. "American Sniper" is much more current than "Flags of our Fathers" which could be a reason why "American Sniper" was so much more successful and popular. The story of Chris Kyle would have been an amazing film wether or not Bradley Cooper was in the film or not.
ReplyDelete"Flags of our Fathers" is a war movie focused on the lives of the men in the raising of the flag in Iwo Jima. Most of the movie is the aftermath of the war and their struggles of dealing with PTSD. I think the moment that really stuck with me was when the guy fell off the boat in the beginning because they weren't even at the war zone and they already lost someone.
I interpreted heroism in "Flags of our Fathers" as being mixed, the heroes didn't think they were heroes but the average person thought they were heroes. The heroes did what they did because they were told to and thought it was the right thing to do and didn't view any of their actions as heroic. In "American Sniper" heroism is definitely in the movie but Chris Kyle doesn't necessarily view himself as a hero or act like a hero.
I liked the end of the movie because it reminded us that the soldiers were really kids. The soldiers were very young and even though they saw horrendous things in war, they were truly kids at heart and they wanted to have fun. It also brought a very light couple of minutes into the very dark movie.
1. I think American sniper was more successful for a number of reasons. First being that a war movie showing the horrors of war is not going to be popular when America is at war. This movie might have discouraged war so people didn't want to see it while they were supporting a current war. People were too angry and sad to end the war in Iraq after 9/11 and this movie sure would have been a wake up call to that. Also American sniper featured a popular actor as the main role with a very current and real story. Like American Sniper, Flags of our fathers was also based on true events but from WWII. The Iraq war is very recent and Chris Kyle was someone many people knew by name as apposed to the people in flags of our fathers. And lastly American Sniper is just overall a better movie. Flags of our fathers was good but I didn't (and I'm sure others would agree) love it and definitely didn't think it was on the same level of cinematic excellence as American Sniper.
ReplyDelete2. I though Flags of our fathers was a good movie but like I said not on the same level as American Sniper. There were points in the movie where I was confused, didn't know who was who, and bored. I didn't have those moments in American Sniper. I also thought the acting in Flags of our fathers was ok but not great (like Bradley Cooper in American Sniper). I feel the movie is about how war is terrible and horrible and how the people deemed heroes in wars are not actually heroes. This point came up a lot throughout the movie, when Ira continuously said that he was not a hero. It also come up at the end the narrator says that heroes are created so people can understand why the men sacrificed what they sacrificed (when in actuality they sacrificed for the people beside the ). The scene that stuck with me was the last scene of the men playing in the water and the narrator saying that's how they should be remembered. This stuck to me because I thought about what the narrator meant, I ended up concluding that the narrator wanted the audience to remember the men and the fun and human men that they were not the "heroes" that they became in the eyes of the public.
3. The movie suggests that heroism in war is just a myth. It says that people can't understand why people would sacrifice so much so they deem them as heroes. When in actuality the "heroes" fight for the men beside them. Although Chris Kyle makes it very apparent that he is fighting for the men beside, and to protect his country and loved ones. Which is interesting because that is a different message than the one I got from Flags of our fathers.
4. I loved the ending, I think it summarized the point Eastwood was trying to make about heroism in a touching and honest way. The ending was actually my favorite scene because it made me think about what that meant and about what it means to be a hero, it was in my opinion of the (if not the) most moving scene in the movie.
"American Sniper" might have been more successful than "Flags of Our Fathers" because of the timing of the movies' release dates. In 2006, America might not have been ready or interested in seeing a movie about a war that happened almost 50 years ago. At the time of the release of "Flags of Our Fathers", America was about five years into the War on Terror. Perhaps if the movie was about the war that was going on at the time, it would have been more successful. As we saw with "American Sniper", a war movie that came out three years after America's most recent war (not counting the War in Afghanistan), moviegoers react more positively to movies about things they can relate to.
ReplyDelete"Flags of Our Fathers" is a movie about the heroes that America needed during WWII. All in all, it didn't matter if the men that went on the tour were the men that raised the flag, because all America needed was something to believe in. Americans saw the picture of the flag being raised and it gave them hope. Really, it's a movie about hope and heroes. Ira, Rene, and John certainly weren't heroes, but America thought they were and they gave American the hope that it needed. In the end that's all that matters. A scene or moment that stuck with me was the ending scene, when the narrator was talking about heroes and what they really are. The last scene of the soldiers playing on the beach of Iwo Jima also stuck with me because it was such an opposite to all the death and destruction we'd seen throughout the movie, but it fit amazingly as an ending.
At the end of the movie, James Bradley says "Heroes are something we create, something we need. It's a way for us to understand what's almost incomprehensible, how people could sacrifice so much for us." this is exactly what the movie is about, any we can tell thins from the moment the military decides to send Ira, Rene, and John home because of their picture. The country needed someone specific to believe in order to believe in the cause, so they created heroes out of them. "American Sniper" is definitely saying something along those lines. In Kyle's case, he actually did everything that he was considered a hero for doing. But that doesn't make him a hero—he killed people.
Maybe Eastwood chose to end the film on this note because it shows that these heroes, these men that American put on a pedestal, were just regular men. They're really no different than anyone else in America. I think Eastwood made this scene the last scene in the movie because it humanizes them. They're not just killing machines.
1. Something that is very interesting when I compared the two movies that we watched was that flags of our fathers received a better rating on rotten tomatoes than American sniper did. That doesn't say much at all because it is really what your opinion is, but in my opinion I thought that American sniper was much better because the watcher got to know Chros Kyle much more than any person in tpfkags of our fathers.
ReplyDelete2. Flags of our fathers is about a very bloody and gruesome battle on an island in Japan where three individuals are picked out for a picture of them raising a flag on topmofna mountain on the island. It goes intonthe personal lives of the tarp here men as they go on a tour to raise money for the military. On the tour we get to know the three individuals (not as much as Chris Kyke) to the point where they become very irrelevant in the war to us.
3. In the end of the movie the narrator said that his father called himself not a hero at all. And in Rennes speeches he describes the people who get killed as thebheros. Not the peiple who were to raise the flag. This is very interesting becausevthis reflects into the work know as well. Everything people see on tv like athletes are portrayed as the real heroes when there are people out in the world Hawthorne are heroes themselves aswell. I found that very interesting.
4. Maybe Clint Eastwood used that as the ending to show that everyone was very similar in the end. My point is that most people died. But the people who didn't were perceived as heroes in that last scene. That is a very big statement. It conradivdts a huge theme of the movie.
I think the reason why flags our fathers didn’t do as well as American Sniper for two reasons, one Flags of our Fathers took place in a different generation from the one that American sniper did. Secondly Flags of our Fathers was much more confusing, the story line was very splotchy in terms of past vs present. it was a lot harder to follow and in American sniper we know that Chris Kyle is a hero which makes us like the movie but we don’t really think that the characters in Flags of our Fathers are heroes. In heroic movies like that it is very hard to have a watcher/movie goer find heroism in an anti hero.
ReplyDeleteIf I were to describe the movie to a friend I would say its about soldiers coming back from war and suffering from PTSD. I didn’t really like this movie all that much just because it was hard to tell what each character was going through individually. i was getting mixed signals for the majority of the movie. one scene that stood out to me was the scene where Ira went to the bar and despite being a “Hero” he still wasn’t served because of his race. That really surprised me and left me wondering why America was glorifying these men but wouldn’t even serve them at a bar.
All I could think about during the movie was that they weren’t really hero at all. Ira was the closest to being a hero in the movie but as much as I liked him as a person i didn’t think of him as a hero. he was robed of being one by Renny. If Ira had stayed and fought instead of leaving and drinking himself into a perpetual state of depression. In my eyes a real hero would stand up to any task he/she is given and Ira had the opportunity to but ruined it by noting being able to cope with his depression.
The ending in my eyes was some what of a happy ending. Even though they were mostly all about to die they put that aside and made a good time out of a bad situation. I thought Eastwood did a good job of ending on a happy note from such a dark part of our history.